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Fading (if not lost) Arts
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vftb
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Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
on:
April 05, 2008, 09:09:27 pm »
Well hell, I'll try to start a discussion. Along with lost ratings, I think there are some "arts" that are quickly disappearing; here's a couple (I knew you guys were just sitting on the edge of your seats waiting for me to dig up some old pictures
):
OBTW, when I got on that airplane at Travis I left all of my shirts behind
; I wear my San Miguel rather well don't you think
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vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #1 on:
April 05, 2008, 09:25:41 pm »
BTW; I'm sure that the second picture was a photo-op staged for mom and dad; had I really needed the steel helmet and the flak jacket there wouldn't have been time for pictures
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Long Thrust VI
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #2 on:
April 05, 2008, 10:14:51 pm »
If an Army NCO had been on board, he'd have hollered at you to
"Buckle that chin strap! You ain't a ****er Spaniel and you ain't a Marine!"
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"The great delusion of the People is that communistic dictatorship can come upon them only through conspiracy and use of military power and that a revolution must occur." --E.C. Riegel
"No one could make a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could do only a little." --Edmund Burke
http://www.Berlin-Brigade.de
vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #3 on:
April 05, 2008, 10:31:57 pm »
We were kind of
informal
.
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vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #4 on:
April 05, 2008, 10:39:43 pm »
Oh, and since you're an Army guy Long Thrust, I'll explain. In that second photo, the lost art I'm referring to is the signal light
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geejaydee
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #5 on:
April 05, 2008, 11:43:12 pm »
Quote from: vftb on April 05, 2008, 09:09:27 pm
(I knew you guys were just sitting on the edge of your seats waiting for me to dig up some old pictures
):
No pictures doing this?
...gjd
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"You know, I am an eternal optimist. That doesn't mean I'm a sap."
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"As we meet here tonight, our men and women in uniform stand watch abroad and more are readying to deploy. To each and every one of them, and to the families who bear the quiet burden of their absence, Americans are united in sending one message: we honor your service, we are inspired by your sacrifice, and you have our unyielding support."
--- President Barack Obama 2/24/09
"America, this is our moment. This is our time. Our time to turn the page on the policies of the past."
--- Senator Barack Obama, June 3, 2008[
vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
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Reply #6 on:
April 05, 2008, 11:47:43 pm »
Nope, no pictures, but I could do it
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JerryM
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #7 on:
April 05, 2008, 11:49:26 pm »
Quote from: vftb on April 05, 2008, 10:31:57 pm
We were
kind of
informal
.
A true master of the fine art of understatement.
I can vouch for that because I was in the same region during the same fiasco.
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Long Thrust VI
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #8 on:
April 06, 2008, 11:08:40 am »
Quote from: vftb on April 05, 2008, 10:39:43 pm
Oh, and since you're an Army guy Long Thrust, I'll explain. In that second photo, the lost art I'm referring to is the signal light
Thanks -- I actually figured that out. It was my good fortune to spend some shipboard duty with Navy & Marine Corps out of Little Creek, Virginia. That was really some of the most fun training I engaged in -- much different than Ft. Riley or Wildflecken!
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"The great delusion of the People is that communistic dictatorship can come upon them only through conspiracy and use of military power and that a revolution must occur." --E.C. Riegel
"No one could make a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could do only a little." --Edmund Burke
http://www.Berlin-Brigade.de
vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #9 on:
April 06, 2008, 11:15:35 am »
Before one of the guys
me, I should correct myself; the art isn't lost, but it has gone down in prominence and is fading. Since there are no more QM's in the Guard I'm not sure how enthusiastic BM's are about practicing the skill
If one of you AD or recent civilians want to enlighten me, I'd be interested
.
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LTGunner
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
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Reply #10 on:
April 06, 2008, 11:17:04 am »
With the loss of specialized ratings, there will be an unfortunate side effect of "subject matter experts". As a Fire Control Technician, I took a lot of pride in Naval Gunnery. The electronics portion was part of the rate; but it was the fundamental understanding of fire control basics that made the rating specialized. Not only did the FT repair radar, computer and gun control equipment, it was the understanding of how that equipment was used in naval gunnery:
Example:
Fire Control Fundamentals, NAVPERS 91900, 1953
I guess the days of FTs, GMs & QMs working together to track and fire on targets are long gone:
Use of Sextant and rangefinder to attack a target on a Schnellboot....
Manouvering a Schnellboot in combat conditions required precision navigation and steering under the most trying of conditions. On a typical combat sortee, the commander, helmsman and navigator worked together to guide the vessel through fjords, narrow inland seas or rock studded coastal waters in pitch darkness. This dangerous feat of seamanship demanded great skill, concentration and constant vigilance.
Source
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EX-CG-GM
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #11 on:
April 06, 2008, 01:57:59 pm »
Quote from: vftb on April 05, 2008, 10:31:57 pm
We were kind of
informal
.
Yeah, just a bit.......not too many ships in the CG that sailed with 60+ cases of beer on board!
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vftb
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #12 on:
April 06, 2008, 02:13:22 pm »
Isn't that what lazaretes were designed for, carrying beer
For those of you who are wondering, on our trips between the P.I. and Vietnam we used to carry a cargo of San Miguel to re-supply our brothers at the Loran Stations and the other outposts. Not to say that we didn't consume a goodly quantity ourselves
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EX-CG-GM
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
«
Reply #13 on:
April 06, 2008, 02:18:32 pm »
Quote from: vftb on April 06, 2008, 02:13:22 pm
Isn't that what lazaretes were designed for, carrying beer
For those of you who are wondering, on our trips between the P.I. and Vietnam we used to carry a cargo of San Miguel to re-supply our brothers at the Loran Stations and the other outposts.
Not to say that we didn't consume a goodly quantity ourselves
...or trade for some scrap brass, or various "souvenirs".....
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LTGunner
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Re: Fading (if not lost) Arts
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Reply #14 on:
April 09, 2008, 07:17:02 pm »
Perfecting the Art of Naval Gunnery
A short essay by -LTGunner-
Anyone can depress the fire button on a weapon system and commence fire on a target. But it takes a true professional to prepare, analyze and predict accurate rounds on target with regards to Naval Gunnery. The art of Naval Gunnery is not as simple as it may seem. There are multitudes of variables that must be taken into consideration. The primary elements of Naval Gunnery are: Target Acquisition, Communications, Relative Ship-Target Position, Fire Control Solution, Aiming & Firing the Gun, Fall of Shot Adjustment and most of all Teamwork. Each of these elements can be very complex. But if they are reviewed and drilled, they can become an integral part of a successful Naval Gunnery Program.
Basic service schools and courses offer general information on Naval Gunnery. This type of training is adequate, but only provides a basic understanding of gunnery principles. Successful gunnery requires sound preparations and drills on a continuing basis. The premise of training is to ensure a full understanding of the weapon systems. This will also instill full confidence within the team. The Combat System Training Team (CSTT) has the responsibility to develop a training plan for the Gunnery Team.
As with any complex system, unscheduled situations do occur. As part of the preparations and drills process, a well-trained Gunnery Team should also prepare for all types of unscheduled situations. This includes equipment casualties, weapon misfires & malfunctions, personnel casualties and communication failures. As a general rule of thumb, prepare for these types of situations and focus on the recovery. Once experience is gained through preparations and drills, a gunnery team can move on to the next phase: the live fire exercise.
To perfect the art of Naval Gunnery, a live fire exercise is a must. Naval Publication SW300-BD-ORD-010 / Preparation, Analysis, and Predicted Accuracy for Naval Gunnery outlines the minimum preparations necessary in order to demonstrate readiness and status of equipment, operational principles and personnel. This is an excellent reference document to prepare for any live fire gunnery exercise.
The live fire exercise should be the highlight of a Naval Gunnery Team. The exercise will enable the team to use their acquired knowledge and gain experience with live ammunition. As the team completes additional live fire exercises they will fully understand the primary elements of Naval Gunnery. If and when the time comes to use the weapon system in an operational situation, their accumulative experience and confidence will ensure accurate and precise rounds on target.
Upon the completion of a successful gunnery exercise the Gunnery Team needs to conduct a Post-Fire Critique. This is a crucial part of the exercise. The Chief Gunnery Observer, usually part of the CSTT, should review each of the primary elements of Naval Gunnery. As a result of this critique, the next gunnery exercise should be planned and focus on the areas of concern.
Preparing for a Gunnery Exercise
Successful exercises are "90% preparation and 10% execution." Chapter 10 of the Preparation, Analysis, and Predicted Accuracy for Naval Gunnery Publication outlines the recommended procedures for conducting a gunnery exercise. The 20 steps listed are in chronological order. The steps are completely in line with the primary elements of Naval Gunnery.
No step should be overlooked or taken for granted. Communications for example is the one of the most important elements taken for granted. Sound powered phone circuits are always assumed to be in good working order, when in reality circuit checks need to be checked prior to every evolution. Standard Gunnery Commands need to be used. Simple terms such as “Commence Fire” should not be replaced with “take with guns” or “fire when ready”. Complete scripts using standard commands need to be prepared, drilled and used consistently.
The Firing Plan is another important Communications document. This is the document that outlines the gunnery exercise. A well-written firing plan outlines the purpose and general requirements of the gunnery exercise. The Firing Plan should never be a copy of a previous successful exercise. Although the format is the same, each exercise is unique and the plan should reflect changes from the CSTT recommendations. A sample Firing Plan can be found in the CG Ordnance Manual (COMDTINST M8000.2C / Enclosure 8). This example is a general guideline and may be modified as needed.
With regards to safety, the Misfire Team is an integral part of the Gunnery Team. Once trained, the Misfire Team should drill with the team as a whole. All too often they drill separately. In the case of an actual misfire, the Gun / Fire Control team works together to clear the fouled bore. As the Misfire Team drills to remove & place a clearing charge in the gun, the Fire Control Team should be drilling to clear the gun via the weapon system (safe firing bearing, fire control solution, area clear, etc…).
The Live Fire Exercise
The actual Live Fire Exercise can be conducted using computer-generated targets. This is a good start for a general exercise to smooth out all of the primary elements of Naval Gunnery. Once the Gunnery Team has successfully completed this type of exercise, it’s time to plan for a live target shoot. A shipboard deployable target can be used as a live target. Although time consuming, the live target exercise is the best type of training for many reasons. First, to train the Gunnery Team on “fall of shot” evaluation. Second to collect Mean Point of Impact (MPI) data for future gunnery evolutions. Third, the target can be used to practice deflection or “offset” firing. In-between firing exercises the floating target can be used to train Deck Officers with at sea ship handling as a target of opportunity.
After Action Critique
As stated earlier, the Gunnery Team needs to conduct a Post Fire Critique. The critique itself is an excellent source of perfecting the art of Naval Gunnery. This is how the Team learns from themselves and refines their talents.
Recommended Reading
COMDNTINST M8000.2C, USCG Ordnance Manual
SW300-BD-ORD-010, Preparation, Analysis, and Predicted Accuracy for Naval Gunnery
SW300-BC-SAF-010, Safety Manual for Clearing of Live Ammunition from Guns
SW225-AO-MA-010, Theory of Combat Systems Alignment
SW030-AA-MMO-010, Navy Gun Ammunition
FXP 2 Anti-Air Warfare exercises (AAW) - contains AAW-1-SF through AAW-27-SF.
FXP 3 Anti-Surface ship exercises (ASUW) - contains ASU-1-SF through ASU-18-SF.
NWP 3-20.3.2, Surface Ship Gunnery
COMNAVSURFLANT/PACINST 3502.2 Surface Force Training Manual
COMNAVSURFLANT/PACINST 3502.3 Surface Force Training Manual Bulletins
Applicable Cutter Combat System Doctrine (NWP 65 Series)
Applicable Weapon System Technical Notes & News Letters
Commanding Officer’s Battle Orders
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